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Sports and the Pulse

Since affiliating myself with this site I have noticed much debate on political issues and morality. What I have not seen is any good discussion on sports. A few have commented on the BYU football uniforms and some on the sports steroid problem, but why is that Pulsers dislike the sports talk? Much of what America is defined by is its greatness in athletic competition. The most watched event on television in the USA is a sport, the Super Bowl. So why should it be different on the Pulse? Sports effect our lives more than we know!

I enjoy such shows on ESPN as 'Around the Horn', 'PTI' and 'Sports Center'. Anyone else? Am I alone in my love of sports in the Pulse? Have nerds taken over the Pulse!?! Please say its not so! J/K.

Sport Buffs Unite: Lets talk more sports on the Pulse.

I like sports as much as the

I like sports as much as the next guy. I guess there isn't much controversial about the general topic of sports to merit submissions or comments from me. And nice conclusion to draw there, that people who don't love sports are nerds.

When I was younger, I could have told you statistics about pretty much any player in MLB or the NBA. I was fanatical about it. The older I've gotten, the more I've seen how professional sports are more about money. It's sad to see the greed and how full of themselves too many players are. Personally, I'd rather watch college games anyday. I watch the Super Bowl, the Championship game, and the World Series.

As for BYU sports, I'm way excited for this year's football season. I never understood why so many students defended Gary Crowton and said he should keep his job. He took a winning team and ran them into the ground. The defense was always awesome though. I remember there were games when the defense would score more points than the offense. So knowing that the defensive coach is now the head coach is a good change. I think I'll actually buy an all-sports pass this year.

Speaking of, was anyone else annoyed when BYU announced that food and drinks wouldn't be allowed for security purposes? Security? That was the best they could do? Not even bottled water?! Then they reassure everyone that concessions will be tripled and one can buy a bottle of water for only three dollars! Come on folks, if you need to raise money, be honest about it.

Well those are my sports rants for the morning.

Ahhh, a real source of discussion... FINALLY!!!

My daily routine revolves around sports. I wake up in the morning and log in and check my various fantasy teams to see how they are performing, then I move over to ESPN.com so I can read the various points of analysis being presented there. (The Sports Guy is about the coolest person in the world) From there I go to the office, which is about a 30-45 minute drive, depending on how traffic is going. I have my radio locked into 1280 The Zone because I must have as much sports in my life as possible. While in the office, I take random web surfing breaks to different sports sites to find little tidbits of data and trivia that I might need to know. The person I work next to is almost as commited to the cause as I am, and we frequently debate the suckiness/greatness of whatever team or player might be in the limelight at the moment. On my lunch break I go out to my car and turn on The Zone while I'm driving to where ever I'm going to get lunch, and I'll always go through the drive through. I'll knock out the last couple of hours at work, drive home, once again listening to the Zone and then come back to my room and turn on ESPN and watch the highlights for at least 30 minutes.

I love sports, all aspects of them. The business of sports, the performance of sports, the discussion of sports, the watching of sports. I can't stand the summer because there is only one game being played. I love october and november because Sportscenter becomes this visual orgy of basketball, football, hockey, baseball, all things that I live and die by.

By the way Farker... if your distate for professional athletes has to do with the insane amounts of money they make, does this mean you have given up the watching of movies, the listening of music and reading of books? We pay for entertainment in all sorts of venues, so why should the salary of a professional sports player be any different than the salary of a movie/tv star, the salary of the touring musician or the lavish earnings of a best selling book author? A lot of these people make many multiples more than the typical athelete in a year but nobody complains about how much they are earning when they are watching the movies, listening to the cds or buying the books. We willingly hand over the money because of why? It's good entertainment. I say pay Tom Brady, Shaq, Pedro Martinez and whoever else is the fricken bomb diggity of their sports whatever money you can, because I love every second of an outstanding performance.

My guess as to why there isn'

My guess as to why there isn't a whole lot of discussion about sports on the Pulse is because, generally speaking (and of course there are exceptions), sports lovers spend their time playing sports or watching ESPN rather than playing on internet blogs, forums, and chat things.

And as far as my favorite sports go, I think it would be hard to find someone who would want to spend time talking about rock climbing or skiing with me online. If I'm wrong, please let me know...I've got to find something to do this summer.

Lack of BYU School Spirit in sports

I've talked with several guys in my apartment complex about the lack of BYU school spirit at sporting events (mainly basketball and football). If there aren't provo sports fans attending the BYU games, they probably won't be online either.

The general consensus has been that it's hard to root for teams that aren't winning very often. (How many Utah Jazz fans are there right now?)

Another reason that gets brought up whenever we talk about the lack of school spirit is the school's affiliation with the church and that it's probably in the best interest to maintain its conservative image.

Are me and my buddies blind to the school spirit? Are we just unfairly comparing BYU fans to other schools' fans shown on ESPN (darn media propaganda)? What can be done to increase fan morale?

During basketball games, when the other team is shooting free throws, where's the waving of the balloons and yelling to distract the opponent? During the BYU - Utah State game, Utah State's fans were louder and more spirited than the BYU fans, and this was at the Marriot Center.

At least there's mens volleyball.

K.C.

Switching topics...

Does anyone know anything about Roman Gardens apartments?
I'm moving there with some friends but I haven't heard anything about the complex. It seems like a pretty nice place. Does anybody live there right now?

Sports...

I relish the moments of watching SportsCenter on my friend's t.v. (I don't have one) every so often. We glory in our little debates over LeBron James, Kobe Bryant, and the rest. However, discussing sports online is like discussing politics and morality in my friend's living room. It just doesn't happen that often. Is it just me? or do guys only talk about sports IN PERSON with other guys?

College athletes getting paid

A few weeks ago there was a 'Town Hall' type of show on ESPN that talked about college athletes getting paid. It was a great show, and both sides of the argument were heard. What do you think?

Should college athletes get paid? Is their compansation enough? How would the game change if they were paid?

Re: Robot/ Paying College Kids

What I was trying to convey was that the majority of those athletes won't move on to the next level...so...

They get a free education and should prepare themselves just like the rest of us paying students to go out and work an everyday job. They just don't have to pay for their education. Sure the University profits off of them, but they don't exactly get messed over either.

A good friend of mine got a full ride to Stanford to play soccer. Her dad calculated all the scholarships, clothes, etc... that she received and came up with a total over $200,000. She received LOTS of free stuff and perks for being a college athlete.

In my opinion salaries in college sports just doesn't make sense. You would inevitably have it turn out like the pro's with athletes bickering over their worth and how big their contract should be. So would you have to pay them all a set amount? One could argue that they are all ready doing that with scholarships etc...

I don't know, I can't say I've researched it too much at all. I still think they're getting a great deal, especially since some of em hardly even play and still have their schooling and other expenses paid for.

Salary caps and professional sports

All right you sports buffs, recently I have been looking at the bickering that has been happening between player unions and management in profesional sports. I have realized that the majority of the problems stem with salary caps. So here is my question to you.What do you think of salary caps in professional sports? What would be the best way? Which Sport has it right?

My personal opinion is that professional football has it right. And...baseball needs a salary cap. I will expound later after I hears some of your opinions.

ESPN's Two Minute Drill

By the way, does anyone remember the game show on ESPN, "Two minute drill"? I loved that show, and I after thinking about it all day today I wrote a letter to ESPN asking to try another season of it. I love it. Kenny Mayne was the perfect host. Her is a link to a discription of the show, Two Minute Drill

Professional Athletes and Salaries

Professional Sports and Money

I have been told by some that our Athletes are being paid too much for what they do. I think this would be a good place to start in our sports talk. Are profesional athletes paid to much?

-Baseball's big-money boom pushed the average salary to a record $2.6 million, with the highest paid player being Alex Rodriguez making $25.7 million.

-The NBA has an average salary of $4.917 million. The highest paid player being Kevin Garnett at $28 million.

-The NFL's average salary is $1.3 million. The highest paid player being Michael Vick with a 10-year, $130-million contract.

What do you think of these numbers? Is it right? Is it too high?

re: lack of school spirit at BYU

Are me and my buddies blind to the school spirit? Are we just unfairly comparing BYU fans to other schools' fans shown on ESPN (darn media propaganda)? What can be done to increase fan morale?

I dont beleive you are wrong. BYU has a problem with its sport immage. Our fans are lazy. They believe that we should have championship every year in every sport, and if we dont then they wont support the team. They are called 'band waggoneers'. Just like the Laker fans, have you seen how much attendance has droped in L.A. in one year? It is ridiculous.

Another problem I bleive is that there is not enough money going into the sporting programs. Some would laugh at my comment, but seriously in comparison with the rest of the nation, we are not up to par. Especially if we want championship teams. I know that we are a Church University, but that doesnt mean we cant be diverse in our choice of non-academic activities. I dont think the only thing should be the BYU Singers. Have you ever seen them sell out a stadium of 60,000?

BYU sports will never be like those of other Universties because the student body is to smart (or so they think) and our University leadership wont put more emphasis on sports. Look what happened to Harvard and Yale. They became 'Academic' universities and down went their athletic programs. We can still be an elite academic school and have great sports. It will just take alittle effort from the student body and our university leaders.

dJake- I think you drew a

dJake-

I think you drew a little bit of a wrong conclusion from what I said. That seems to be happening a lot lately (not just with you).

My beef is not about how much players are paid. What I tend to see is that college sports are more about the love of the game. There's more sportsmanship and less cockiness. I can't stand watching dances in the end zone and fights on the basketball court. It's stupid. It's grown men acting like little kids because they get paid a fortune and have met their goals. Yes, they get paid too much money. Tickets cost too much money. Concessions cost too much money. The advertising has gone too far (e.g. I read something about the actual bases in MLB will have company logos on them). Bottom line is that I see more of what I like in college sports than I do in professional sports.

Jon- Submit your questions a

Jon-
Submit your questions as an article. It will probably make the front page and won't be threadjacking.

You see john, this is what i

You see john, this is what i am trying to start here on the Pulse. Its time to let out our sport frustration and share it with others. I love debating sports, I can tell alot of other pulsers that i never would have believed do also. This is great.

My vote is 'no'

Anyone who knows me knows how much I love sports. I love watching them, playing them, talking about them, etc. I have known a few of the athletes here at BYU through classes and other things, and in the end, I think that college players shouldn't be paid. Most athletes on campus are on scholarship. Included in this scholarship (most the time) is tuition, books, housing, food and also a few hundred dollars for other needs. So...they get to come and play a sport they love, get all the things provided for them for a comfortable living, and if they are smart...they leave college with a college degree to have as a back-up JUST IN CASE they don't go pro (or if they do, in case they have a career-ending injury).

I know some people will argue that they spend hours in the weight room, on the field in practice and games, travelling...all while trying to do their class work, etc. While this is true...athletes also receive open tutoring for their classes. If they are struggling and in risk of their grades dropping, they then get a personal tutor (paid for by the athletic department) to help keep them up in their work.

I just don't see how they are at any disadvantage than other students on campus that they need to receive a salary for what they do...cause in reality, they already are. It's no different than students who are on scholarship. They too get tuition, and if they are smart enough, even more paid for. Instead of hours on the practice field, they spend hours in the books so they can keep their grades up and keep their scholarship. So then will we need to pay them as well? Because just like sports bring prestige to a school, so do the academics. The BYU Accounting program is #3 in the nation...those students work VERY hard, are required to cut back their work hours (which can translate into a student loan), and they bring alot of attention to this school (and sometimes, better attention than the sports program depending on the year.) So perhaps we should pay them as well?

Again, I LOVE sports. I love watching them and I appreciate the work that goes into it for the athletes. I think that they get plenty for what they do. I would have loved to be talented enough in any of the sports that I play to be able to have the deal that they do! I'm not saying they get too much, but I do think they get enough. But I think that putting money into it at the college level would kill the game that is specifically 'college sports'. At a college level, they still have something higher to attain to (a professional career). While many of the athletes at a college level are doing it for the free ride to a college education, many of them also do it as a stepping stone into their professional athletic career. So along with the other things they get (education paid for, housing, spending money, etc)...they also get the media venue to help showcase their skills to impress the professional scouts who otherwise may have never seen them.

Everyone in college is working for what they get...whether it is at a $6.45 an hour job on campus for 4 hours a day to pay for all you need, or practicing for 4 hours day to 'pay' for all you need (oh, or your dad working for 10 hours a day to pay for all of your things! I don't want to leave any of those people out! :))it seems to all equal out in the end.

Purity of the Game

Chelsy said alot of what I would have said so I'll just add these two thoughts:

  1. College atheletes are already getting paid essentially already. Granted, coming to BYU amounts to crap for pay in comparison to going to Stanford or Duke or UNC, but either way, the college athlete is recieving compensation by trade instead of in cash. And the fact that they get money to live off of during their stay at school? That's a steal at half the price.
  2. If you are going to pay college athletes, why not pay high school athletes? There are some pretty big basketball and football high schools out there. Alex Smith and Reggie Bush both came from the same high school in San Diego. Wanna bet that they would have been worth paying back then? Just like you have to go to school and graduate before you can go out to the real world and get a sweet job, the same should be true of playing time in the college atheletics. Prove your worth and then take your skill out onto the open market.

Endorsements for college athletes

I agree with you all on the points that college athletes should not get paid for their playing ability. I think that Schools have compansated them enough with their scholarships and their living allowances. They are already getting paid in my books. For the university to offer them more would be ridiculous.

However I think it would be ok of college athletes to sign endorsements of any sort. Of course that goes against the NCAA's rule that no player can work and receive more than $1500. I think that rule is ridiculous. If the players want to work and get a headstart on life then let them. Not all of them are going to go pro and make millions of dollars. But even if they do, why can't they make money of their own valition now. Now dont get me wrong, I am totaly against free-bees from Alumni, but I think any college athlete should be allowed to make a legitate taxable income. And of course that would include endorsements. I think by allowing players the oppertunity to receive endorsements would actually help the game by getting the players name out there. The coaches are allowed to sign endorsements so why not the players? I wish the NCAA didnt try to control the lives of the players so much. I havent really talked about this with many people so I would like to know what you think.

Once again, I think it would be ok for college athletes to sign endrosements with different companies to make money. I believe that any legitament taxable income should be allowed to be earned by any NCAA athlete. I dont like the NCAA policy on allowing the players not to work. What do you think?

The salary cap

I had this long running debate over salary caps with my buddy who is one of the biggest hockey fans in the world. (Imagine this, a Canadian who loves hockey. It's the newest thing) His argument was that in what business do you find an artificial ceiling on how much somebody could make? I take a dim view of that argument simply because the NHL as an organization is providing the players an opportunity to play in a highly marketed organization. The business owners create the business, the players are employees of said business. The employees DON'T have to work their. They can go work somewhere else if they aren't happy with the conditions.

Having said that, I think the NBA has the best salary setup with the exception of one thing. Guaranteed contracts bug the crap out of me because a player can go and suck it up all season long for one season, but when the time comes to sign a new contract, you'll see people playing out of their mind for a whole season to get the huge deal. I think a contract should be like 25% guaranteed or something like that. Anyways, on to the issue at hand.

The NBA's salary cap is probably the ideal example. It's a soft cap where you CAN go over it, but you get penalized heavily if you do. For example, Isiah Thomas can overspend the cap by $200 trillion dollars if he really feels the desire to do so, but he'll end up sending the league a check for $199.995 trillion dollars, on top of player salaries. Speaking of which... isn't it funny how Isiah Thomas ALWAYS spends too much for people who are no more than role players? It's one of those things you can count on, Isiah will spend too much money for a player that isn't worth 50% of what he's getting paid. By having a soft cap, a team that is in a larger market with much higher ticket prices can pay out additional money to players to keep them around, but then they also have to worry about paying the luxury tax, a dollar for dollar amount on every dollar you are over the cap. Pure genius if you ask me.

I don't like the NFL's salary cap because it hasn't created any kind of leveling effect (ie, getting all of the teams to the same theoretical playing level) and it has good players getting cut left and right because every year purely for cap reasons. I love the NFL, but I really wish Paul Taglibue would make something happen in the next CBA that would allow the cap to be a little more flexible.

Baseball should get a salary cap, but they never will because George Steinbrenner likes to spend as much money as he see fit to get into the world series. Somebody should point out to George that chemistry is more important than talent. He should buy a chemical engineer to take the team he has and give them some chemistry. Incidentally... that's why the Lakers lost last year and the Pistons won. Chemistry wins.

Professional Athlete's and the Money They Make

There are no doubt that there are overpaid athletes out there, and A-Rod is a prime example of an athlete who is getting paid far more than he is worth. Kevin Garnett is an example of an athlete who is working for every penny he's paid. (Incidentally, for the '04-'05 season, Kevin reworked his contract and he is making ONLY $16,000,000)

I'll tell you one major complaint I have about professional athletes... guaranteed salaries. Follow me for a sec on this:

If I, as an employee of any business, sign a five year deal because the previous year I had made a phenomenal performance during the pervious year or couple of years, and then proceeded to suck it up for the next three years, wouldn't I get fired? Almost every contract ever signed has an out clause for the person paying out on the contract. Why? Because if you suck at your job they need to be able to get rid of you and get somebody who won't suck it up. There are no guarantees in life.

Unless...

In the NBA and MLB contracts are guaranteed for the life of the deal. People will play well leading up to the signing of a new contract, but then will start to completely suck it up after their contract is signed. And the players unions of both leagues have made sure that even the crappiest players, once they sign a contract, get paid. Players take a year off because they know they can get away with it. Incidentally, this is one of my major arguements against unions in general and player's unions specifically.

Take the NFL for example. You get your signing bonus, which is guaranteed, and then the contract is only as good as you are willing to play. If you don't meet expectations, then you get waived and some other team can take a chance on you. A-Rod would have been cut from the Rangers (and yes, I know he's a Yankee now) long ago because he simply wasn't playing up to expectations.

But in general, I think we need to pay the guys who play really well good money, it's good entertainment for us all.

Latrell Sprewell

Personally I'm not opposed to how much professional athletes make in general, but I disagree with some individuals specifically. I think a good quote that epitomizes what Farker is saying comes to us via DickVitale's column on espn.com:

Here's a guy making $14.6 million a season to play in the NBA, yet he claims that he didn't know why he'd try to help the Timberwolves win a world championship because they aren't doing anything for him in terms of a contract extension.

The St. Paul Pioneer Press quoted Sprewell as saying, "Why would I want to help them win a title? They're not doing anything for me. I've got a lot at risk here. I've got my family to feed."

Ahh, the love of the game.

"What I tend to see is that college sports are more about the love of the game"

Of course, what else would you tell student-athletes that are being exploited? Do it for the love of the game! What a farce.

Universities run athletes' bodies into the ground, and then spit them out when they have no more use for them.

These 'kids' bring in MILLIONS of dollars to the universities, and what do they get? A stipend? A 1500 scholarship. How pathetic.

Celebrations are awesome.

I can't stand watching dances in the end zone and fights on the basketball court. It's stupid. It's grown men acting like little kids

That is part of the sports that we love. You cant tell me that if you were in front of 60,000, and you just made a sweet touchdown that you wouldnt celebrate alittle. I would freak out and probably get fined so much it would be ridiculous. Besides these athletes are merely playing to the crowd. The crowd is the ones that want them to act that way. I love Terrel Owens dancing and celebrations. I cant wait till he scores just to see what he is going to see next. He is just having fun with his job. I think so many americans are jealous because they hate their jobs. These men love their jobs and they have fun with it!

The reason there is so much money in professional sports is because it is a business that is out to make money. Its differnt than college sports. Tickets cost alot because we are willing to pay for them. If we didnt pay the prices then they would be cheaper. That is just simple economics

And Harvard is the most respe

And Harvard is the most respected university in the nation, so what's your point? ;)

my bad

i'm new

players salaries

I have to say that I cant stand to hear it when people complain about how much professional athletes get paid. The reason they get paid so much is because we as the masses put that value on them. They excell at what they do and we are willing to see them in action and we are willing to pay even more if they win.

The other day I heard this sap story of how the average rate of pay for teachers is only $40,000 or something like that. And our society is messed up that athletes are making millions a year just playing a sport. So what? That is all I can say. These athletes are paid the amount they are because that is what they are worth to society. That point has been proven in the whole NHL debaucal. The players want more money than the league can pay them. Did you know that in 2003 the NHL lost 270 million dollars! That is insane. Put simply the NHL does not hold that great of value to society anymore. Players are paid what they are because of the value the masses put on them. It is that simple.

You are all wrong.

"everyone in college is working for what they get"

No. They don't. You are EQUALIZING THINGS that are NOT EQUAL. When was the last time BYU students working as janitors brought in 15 million dollars for six hours of work? (Just in case you don't know, I'm refering to football bowl games).

BYU student athletes are just being used as tools. Even though it is the student's body on the line, Universities get millions while students get scraps, i.e., 150 dollar stipends and $1500 tuition scholarships. It is called exploitation. Why can't all of you see this?

Why don't student athletes get more? It is not because they don't deserve it; it is because they are not united, and they're being duped into ruining their bodies for the some artificial altruistic nonsense.

You don't see coaches working for free, so why should the athletes?

Wrong.

"If you are going to pay college athletes, why not pay high school athletes? "

Are you saying the Provo high bulldogs bring in as much revenue as BYU football? Those high schools that do make a lot of money should give some back to the students. Why is this unreasonable?

"Just like you have to go to school and graduate before you can go out to the real world and get a sweet job, the same should be true of playing time in the college athletics."

No. Athletics is not like accounting. You don't need a liberal education to play basketball. You just need to be 8 feet tall. Period.

Threadjacking? Simmer down nitro.

Sheesh...you make him sound like a terrorist.

Did you look this one up on dictionary.com too?

Endorsements for college athletes

So what about it folks? Should college athletes be allowed commercial endorsements since they arnt paid by the university?