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"Bleeding Heart Elitists"

This is short, so I will quote its entirety, found in the Daily Universe.

As is apparent from recent articles and editorials in The Daily Universe, there is much self-congratulating and mutual back patting among the Mormons who are liberals among us. Just because they break with what they perceive as the unthinking majority of Utahns and Mormons in general, liberal Mormons suppose themselves by some stretch of the imagination to be more intelligent than the rest of us.

Religion is independent of politics. The fact that the vast majority of Mormons are Republicans has absolutely no bearing on the fact that the Democratic Party is for bleeding heart elitists who support the wasting of taxpayer funds so that they can feel good about themselves. As a wise man once said, at no point in your incoherent ramblings did you come close to anything that would be considered a rational thought. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your (liberal) soul.

Todd Barfuss

Farmington

[The last two sentences weren't included in the published version.]

Let me start by saying I endorse neither of the mentioned parties.

But this kid that sent in this letter is stupid. "Self-congratulating and mutual back patting?" Members of both parties are guilty of this. "...liberal Mormons suppose themselves by some stretch of the imagination to be more intelligent than the rest of us," No buddy, that's no stretch of the imagination. The thing is, liberals among this Mormon culture are generally more intelligent. Sound biased? Find me a genuine liberal Mormon who isn't more knowledgable about politics than the average conservative Mormon. Even here on ProvoPulse, the liberals tend to be much more researched. I'd venture to say that the vast majority of conservative Mormons are only conservative because they've been brought up that way, and don't understand even the most basic ideals of their party.

Todd here says that religion has nothing to do with politics. Funny, just a couple weeks ago I submitted a thread regarding gay marriage (which Republicans are almost violently against), and the bottom line of that discussion was that there was no non-relgious reason to ban gay marriage. Nothing constitutional about it. Churches of all kinds are pouring money into politics, including our own. Has Bush ever made an entire speech without mentioning God?

The fact that the vast majority of Mormons are Republicans has absolutely no bearing on the fact that the Democratic Party is for bleeding heart elitists who support the wasting of taxpayer funds so that they can feel good about themselves.

What is this supposed to mean? What does that fact that Mormons are Republicans have anything to do with Dems being bleeding heart elitists blah blah blah? Issues like abortion and homosexuality aside, I'd suggest that the Democratic party, as a whole, is much more charitable (and thus Christlike) than the Republican party. Again, as a whole. I know a great deal of very generous Republicans.

Barfuss finishes his holier-than-thou letter with an Adam Sandler quote (which is probably appropriate for his displayed intelligence level), suggesting that liberals have no rational thoughts. To which I would reply, Todd, in your proud letter, you never bothered to address a single one of those issues.

I admire those Republicans among us who can carry on an intelligent discussion without such terms as, "libtard," "bleeding-heart," and so forth. It's not the party I despise, it's attitudes like Todd's that irk me. And let's just acknowledge right now that democrats, republicans, conservatives, liberals alike all have people like Todd here who smear the reputations and good things and people in all groups.

Idiocy in motion

I love reading stuff like what Todd here writes. Politics are a regional thing more than anything. Mormonism teaches both conservative and liberal concepts, such as obeying the law of chasity, the word of wisdom, being honest in your dealings, charity, compasssion. The fact that a vast majority of Utah is conservative makes for a lot of stupid conservatives. They take the talking points from the local GOP and without ever finding out what their own political "belief" system is.

Being a liberal in Utah is kinda like being a conservative in New York. You have to break out of the mold that everybody else was cast in and figure things out for yourself. I do think that liberal Mormons tend to believe that since they "figured it out" that it entitles them to think that they are flying above the group in intelligence. This isn't necessarily a hit against liberal Mormons, because I believe that I am flying above the rest of the crowd too. Knowledge is power, and those who don't seek it, liberal and conservative alike, are mere grunts in the intellectual scheme of things.

I'm not suggesting that there should be more liberals out there, because when it comes down to it, I believe that the liberal train of thought has been derailed for a long time. I just wish there were more intelligent conservatives out there.

For the record, my favorite term for anybody on the far left side of the debate is "dimocrats." The light may be on, but nobody is home ;) j/k

Ha ha, I thought of a

Ha ha, I have a good reply:

As is apparent from Todd Barfuss' criticism of Democrats and/or liberals, there is much haughtiness and finger-pointing among the Mormons who don't like liberals among us. Just because they break with what they perceive as the unpatriotic minority of Utahns and Mormons in general, conservative Mormons suppose themselves, by some stretch of the imagination, to be more Christian than the rest of us.

Politics ought to be independent of religion, though that is hardly the case. The fact that the vast majority of Mormons are Republicans has absolutely no bearing on the fact that the Republican Party is for close-minded elitists who support the wasting of taxpayer funds so they can feel patriotic about killing some perceived enemies. As a wise man once said, ye strain at a gnat and swallow a camel. I award you 8 points for trying to impersonate someone with no critical thinking skills.

I never have the guts to send this stuff in.

Dude, they would SO publish that.

It is just what the Daily Puniverse is looking for to keep the readership coming back for more Letters to the Editor (ever read the ones in the Daily Herald? They're so boring in their civility).

For me, it's not that I don't like Mormon Democrats/Liberals, but the ones I have met strike me as very un-liberal and un-Democrat, as far as labels go. For example, I once met a kid who was top brass in the College Democrats club. Through our conversation it came out that he's anti-gay-marriage, pro-life, and owns more guns than he does books. I wanted to say to him, "You're not liberal! You're a compassionate conservative!" Why does he identify himself as a Democrat when he doesn't align himself with the major issues of their platform?

I've come across the same thing as far as so-called Mormon feminists, too. If they're feminist, then I must be feminist. So why are we using such loaded terms?

I think they just want attention. To each his own.

I do have non-religious

I do have non-religious convictions of why homosexuals shouldn't marry.

Like...?

I've got moral reasons against it as well, but haven't heard what I'd consider a credible reason that doesn't involve religion or God. I'd be happy to hear one.

As a wise man once said, at

As a wise man once said, at no point in your incoherent ramblings did you come close to anything that would be considered a rational thought.

Wait a minute... Is this guy talking about himself? Because that pretty much sums up his letter. If you want to talk about self-congratulatory back patting, simply listen to the way Mormons usually talk about themselves and the church. The gist of most of it boils down to "Mormons are all so great, wonderful and, most of all, not going to hell! Hurray for Mormons! We're the best! Screw the rest!"

Stupidity has no political affiliation. There are absolute and utter morons who belong to both parties. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to point this out. Thank you, Todd Barfuss, for stating the obvious. Now, did you have anything of value to say? Didn't think so.

To this Todd Barfuss guy it's about being on the "winning team" and nothing more. Ideology really no longer matters to most people.

Case in point? The Bush Administration. Here we have an administration who is irresponsibly spending our tax dollars at an unprecedented rate and driving up the deficit faster than ever before, starting wars on knowingly false information and sending our troops to their unneeded deaths, ignoring natural disasters at home until people are dying en masse, while top administration officials break the law for petty revenge and financial gain. Bush et al might wear the Republican badge but their actions speak louder than words. There is neither compassion nor conservatism in them. But notice how rank and file Republicans still support Bush Co. 100%. Why? Because they are simply party apple polishers who do not understand what the ideological underpinnings of conservatism are supposed to be. Or they simply don't care.

And that is why this country is and will continue to go to hell. The fast food attitude of America of prepackaged sound bytes, talking head political pundits doing the analyzing for us and a "choose between party A or party B" system has replaced true intellectual responsibility and a real understanding of political issues because most Americans are just too busy discussing who won the f*cking World Series or what happened on Desperate Housewives this week.

Hooray for intellectually lazy and irresponsible mainstream America! If our world comes crashing down on us we will have no one to blame but ourselves.

BTW, the guy's last name starts with "Barf." Seems pretty apropos to me. :D

barf

Yeah, I agree. His last name is Barfuss. We can't take him seriously.

Todd, if you read this, Scott Barfuss' mail comes to my house. Maybe you know him. Stop by sometime and get it.

You're welcome to send it in

You're welcome to send it in under your own name!

But I agree, people tend to adopt these labels as if it makes them cool or something.

I'm not smart enough to know exactly what each party represents. I see a lot of good and bad in both areas. And I'm biased, because the only politically outspoken "conservatives" that I know are also the most cheap and hypocritical people I know.

Question:

Do you ever say anything nice?

hey now

my mom's maiden name is Barfuss....and she voted for Nader!

I hate to say it.....

I hate to say it but I believe you all have just proven Barfuss' original point. Though perhaps it could have been worded more tactfully, it is obviously a call for liberals to leave alone conservatives who have honestly thought about their beliefs.
I wholeheartedly agree with you that one can be liberal and a Latter-day-saint. Personally I feel I am somewhere in the middle, though by the standards presented here, I probably am on the conservative side. That aside all I see on this page are comments that would lead me to believe that most of you are exactly the people that Barfuss is commenting about. Liberals who only profess to believe that way because they wish to go against the grain, not because they actually sat down and decided that it is what they believe.
I agree with Barfuss that I hate be criticized for my conservative views just because the majority around me believe the same way. I come from a very liberal state, like your New York example, to Provo for school, and my political views are what they are, not subject to change based on location. I would have worded the article differently, but basically I am tired of people saying that I simply follow the unthinking masses, and I am sick of liberals who only are liberal to get attention and because they feel like they are being anti-conformists. Purposefully conforming to the opposite of the majority, whatever it is, would be its own form of conformity.

Well, to be outspoken about

Well, to be outspoken about anything almost automatically betrays a superficial understanding of the issue at hand. These are the kind of people who are more concerned about being certain than they are about being right.

The most telling thing about politics is that, as dJake mentioned above, they're more regional than anything. Another major factor in a person's policital orientation is what your parents are. This proves that neither party or extreme can be completely correct. The vast majority of people are raised with certain mindsets, and then they selectively focus on things that reinforce it, and ignore or weakly explain away things that contradict it.

The people at either end of the spectrum who actually sit down and think about things will find themselves being pulled towards the middle.

Oh yeah?

Well, you guys are just jealous, because you're not cool enough to be libertarian like me!

Actually, I do align myself as mostly conservative, but also find that LDS Republicans typically can't stand up against scrutiny. Sorry, but in the world of politics and debate, "The Book of Mormon says so" is NOT a valid reason. Sorry. I do have non-religious convictions of why homosexuals shouldn't marry. I do have non-religious convictions of why abortion should only be allowed in certain cases. If I wasn't LDS, I'd still have them. I rather feel sorry for those who only believe in things because they're told to, and never really think for themselves about issues - for instance, would you REALLY not gamble if "the church told you not to"? Would you still be monogamous? There are perfectly good non-LDS reasons why you should be, but do you really believe them, and can you argue them if challenged?

And as for everything else, I'll admit that I'm cheap, but it's just because I'm a poor college student.

Sure. I love you. See? That

Sure.

I love you.

See? That was nice. Pointless and asinine, but nice.

I don't post here to be "nice." I post here to state my opinions on matters. If they offend you because they aren't dumbed down and sugar coated, I'm truly sorry. I will try to keep my mean comments to myself now so as not to hurt your feelings.

Oh wait.

No, I won't.

What?

Actually, I'm not jealous of someone like you, because you are very stuck up. Oh, and Satan tried to "think for himself", and look where it got him. You need to rethink things before you right it and make yourself look like a jerk.